Jury indicated it could not reach a verdict, but was ordered to push on? : Melbourne Indymedia

A man accused of planning to blow up the national electricity grid or a Sydney defence site has been found guilty of serious thought crimes.

Faheem Khalid Lodhi, 36, is the first person in the country to be convicted of planning a terrorist act and faces a maximum penalty of life in jail.

Before he was arrested, Lodhi had gathered maps, chemicals and recipes for poisons and homemade bombs but not to carry out any plan. However the fact that he like all of us collected things before being arrested somehow made him guilty of a crime?

He allegedly downloaded the material off the Internet, which is not usually illegal?

Before delivering its verdict though, just after 2pm today, the NSW Supreme Court jury of six men and six women had deliberated for five days.

The jury had previously indicated it could not reach a verdict after the seven-week trial, but was ordered to push on? Why was that? And on whose order? Against the decision of the jury? What do you call that? Fraud!

Fishing Expedition

As evidence Lodhi was planning the attack, the prosecution relied on several documents seized during ASIO raids in October, 2003, at the Lakemba home where Lodhi lived with his wife, Aysha Hamedd, and from his desk at his workplace in the city.

They included a so-called "terror manual", a 15-page, handwritten document in Lodhi's native Urdu language with numerous recipes for explosives and poisons that he had obtained from the Internet. Lodhi said he was just curious and had paid little attention to it.

The prosecution also produced a list of chemical prices Lodhi had sought, maps of the national electricity grid he had bought.

Is it illegal to buy maps of the electricity grid? Only if you're an accused terrorist?

Police also seized DVDs and CDs of alleged jihadist doctrine and alleged terror training. Which is not usually illegal? What about Rambo?

The prosecution also alleged that Lodhi was in close contact with French terror suspect Willy Brigitte while the latter was in Sydney and had used a false name to open a mobile phone account to call Brigitte.

But lots of people have phone accounts with false names. When the technology first came out most people I know got an account with a false name.

Willy Bridgitte was a scapegaoat and only an alleged terror suspect as well so why not tie up all the scapegoats and make them look as guilty as each other?

Lodhi had offered various explanations for the documents - the chemical list was for an export company he was planning, the maps a marketing tool for another planned venture to send generators to Pakistan and the aerial photographs were for his resume as he had worked on each of the defence sites in the past.

He also gave false personal details for the chemical and map inquiries but said it was a mistake. Common mistakes are made and if only they weren't you still have to have some reason to want to buy chemicals and there is no evidence of a bomb factory or material to support the planning of making a bomb?

Nevertheless the jury was forced to comply with the JUDGES ORDERS AND
Lodhi was found guilty of three terror-related charges, one of which carries life and two a maximum of 15 years' jail.

These charges were that he collected maps of the Australian electricity supply system in preparation of a terrorist act (15 years), BUT WITH NO DETAILS ABOUT THE PREPARATION ACCEPT MATERIAL TO SUPPORT THOUGHT CRIME? that he sought information on chemical prices for the use of explosives for a terrorist act (life), BUT NO SOUND EVIDENCE ABOUT WHETHER THE CHEMICALS WERE GOING TO BE PURCHASED OR USED FOR THE USE OF EXPLOSIVES OR A TERRORIST ACT and that he possessed a document with information on the manufacture of poisons and bombs in preparation for a terrorist act (15 years). THAT HE LIKE MANY OTHERS MAY HAVE DOWNLOADED FROM THE INTERNET WHICH IS NOT ILLEGAL USUALLY?

SUBSEQUENTLY He was found not guilty of one charge of downloading aerial photographs of Sydney defence sites in preparation of a terror act (15 years).

SO WHAT IS THIS ALL ABOUT WHAT TERRORIST ACT IN AUSTRALIA OR ANYWHERE FOR THAT MATTER? THIS IS FRAUD!

THE GRAND FINALLY

He still faces five charges of making a false or misleading statement to ASIO? WHY WOULDN'T YOU LOSE YOUR MEMORY WHILE BEING INTERIGATED AND ISOLATED IN A HOLDING CELL WITH THEM?

The Sunni Muslim, who emigrated from Pakistan in 1998 for a better life, repeatedly denied being a terrorist, saying that killing innocent people was not part of Islam.

"This country is my country. These people are my people," he told the court.

Justice Anthony Whealy remanded Lodhi in custody to face sentencing submissions on June 29.

THE ORIGINAL EVIDENCE OF STORING OVER 100 ROLLS OF TOILET PAPER TO MAKE A BOMB WAS NOT SEEN OR HEARD OF AGAIN! FUNNY THAT!

SHAME HOWARD SHAME ON YOU!

Some Practicalities Of Emptying The Prisons [287]
Given the importance that prisons and punishment have in maintaining control of increasingly restless populations, the task of achieving the release of the people in the jails and the closure of those institutions, seems daunting. But it is so vital to the 2nd Renaissance that we must find ways to do it.

http://melbourne.indymedia.org/news/2006/06/115092.php

A jury will often be asked to continue deliberations by the trial judge, particularly if they are in the early stages of their discussion.

How long a judge gives a jury depends on the length of the trial, amongst other considerations. For example, a jury who has heard evidence for two days only would not be sequested for a week. A jury which received evidence over several weeks or months, however, may well be.

The defence had serious problems due to the implausibility of Mr Lohdi's claims. The gist of those claims has been thoughtfully provided by the above fuckwit.

Obviously, it is not illegal to buy a map of the electricity grid. Why, doesn't everyone have one?

Just kidding.

Similarly, it is not illegal to make enquiries about chemical prices and availability. It's also not illegal to possess DVDs of jihadist doctrine, per se. But this charge is analagous to a would be burglar being caught dressed in black down a laneway late at night, in possession of a crow bar, torch, gloves, scaling hook and rope and kit bag. Possession of those individual articles on their own is not illegal. But possessed in the totality of the circumstances as described, a crime is disclosed. Going equipped with housbreaking implements, to quote the law.

The thing is, lots of people DON'T have phone accounts with false names, although I'm sure that the above author probably knows people who do. I just get that feeling.

Lohdi did in fact offer various explanations for the documents. That was the problem; they changed as the trial proceeded. The chemical list was for an export company he was planning, the maps a marketing tool for another planned venture to send generators to Pakistan and the aerial photographs were for his resume as he had worked on each of the defence sites in the past.

Yeah. Right.

He also gave false personal details for the chemical and map inquiries but said it was a mistake. False name to the chemical company, false name to the telephone company. Anyone seeing a pattern here? The jury sure did.

Of course, the jury was NOT forced to comply with the judge's orders. They acquitted him of one charge, in fact.

Thank you for presenting as a true blue, rolled gold and genuinely ill-informed fuckwit of the highest order.

We salute you, sir!

How about we open up all your personal details mr and tell me that we won't find something we can put together to convict you of a crime.

Only a person who lacked knowledge and understand of the new draconian laws that don't give these people a hope in hell of being found innocent would condemn this person for a possible 15 years to life!

That is the second problem the first problem is that the trial process is unfair and unreasonable and the rules have changed so that even their own lawyers cannot defend them because what they were taught at law school no longer applies.

Then all you have as the writter suggests is a thought crime! Nothing this man did was a crime less than crimes that are committed each and ever day by other people walking the streets who are white.

The jury was pushed to make a decision that's not fair if they did not agree. He had a plausable excuse for the military maps why not a plausable excuse for the rest?

Wake up Australia!

In my home I have a hammer and screwdriver and over the net I could most likely get any map or formula I want. I could ring a chemical supplier, drug dealer or even a massage parlor at sometime in my life and make an enquiry using a false name as say, Blow Job charlie.

Then get a phone that's not in my name to contact them with.

I'm profiled as a scapegoat, ASIO organise a fishing expedition, line up the parrot people and then nail me to the wall ordering the jury to push on because they were undesided?

Excuse me! What county is this?

You say, "But this charge is analagous to a would be burglar being caught dressed in black down a laneway late at night, in possession of a crow bar, torch, gloves, scaling hook and rope and kit bag. Possession of those individual articles on their own is not illegal. But possessed in the totality of the circumstances as described, a crime is disclosed. Going equipped with housbreaking implements, to quote the law."

==================================

The person was not caught dressed in black down a laneway late at night. That's your problem there was no 'plot' to describe accept a raid on the mans property and a jigsaw puzzle.

I have house breaking implements in my home and so do you and to quote the law it is otherwise not illegal!

Now if I walked passed the Macquarie Bank as well and contacted them using another name does that mean that I intended to rob them?

Even if someone had photographed me with a bag over my head?

You simply need concrete evidence not some notion of someone's thoughts!

Now we're moving into assuming and we all know how wrong assuming can be!

I think the FW was attempting use the analogy of the would-be burglar possessing articles for housebreaking to explain the preparatory nature of the offence under discussion. These laws are designed to provide early intervention in the case of someone preparing to commit an act of terrorism. Obviously, walking past Macquarie bank carrying housebreaking implements at lunch time would not constitute an offence. However, loitering at 3.00 am armed with the same implements with a bag on your head may. And your explanation (or lack thereof) for being so found would form part of the evidence against you.

You are right about needing concrete evidence. That comes in the form of all of the circumstances surrounding the possession of the articles.

The jury heard all the evidence, including the defendant's explanations, which were tested under cross examination.

You're right when you say assuming can be wrong. So let's not assume that the people who heard every piece of evidence got it wrong and that those whose knowledge is limited to press reports and personal prejudices against lawful authority are right.

The problem as I see it is that money was not the issue otherwise the bank could well have been a terrorist plot! However like someone said there was no plot just circumstantial evidence after a fishing expedition that collected many items that an individual collected over and extended period of time.

Is downloading material off the internet a crime? If it is then we should be well aware of it I should think. What is bannned and what is not? For Christ Sake are we allowed to look at things posted to the Net? No matter what?

Or even download or print such articles and look at them?

Does not mean any intention just being inquisitive about material.

This is a disaster and a terrorist act perpetrated on the citizens of Australia for thoughts someone thinks they might have? In short a STAR CHAMBER!

Why do people on this site support someone who was obviously intent on committing mass murder?

Are you all crazy?

"Are you all crazy?"

By George! I think she's got it!

Well if we arn't crazy we should be with what is going on!

Are you serious?

2 Billion on choppers

The government is spending 2 Billion dollars on death machines.

Cancer is more of a threat than terrorism.
Heart disease is more of a threat than terrorism.
Urban pollution is more of a threat than terrorism.

http://melbourne.indymedia.org/news/2006/06/115165.php

Wakey, wakey hands off snaky!

Wondering;

"Why do people on this site support someone who was obviously intent on committing mass murder?"

Because they also support people who have already committed mass murder. For example, Fidel Castro, Kim Jong Il and the Iraqi "resistance".

They also do a handy line in Holocaust denial.

This is my favourite bit;

"But after almost a week of deliberating, the jury decided that Lodhi's inquiries about chemicals, his strange decision to write out a manual on explosives and buy maps of the electricity grid were indeed enough to find that he was preparing an act of terrorism. Even without the elusive Brigitte, Lodhi was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt."

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/the-man-who-met-brigitte/2006/06/19/1150701484592.html?page=3

Oh, boo hoo. A Jew-baiting murderer won't walk free.

Oh, boo hoo boo hoo boo hoo boo hoo boo hoo

Why do you think thought crime is against the law?

It attempts to give the government some ligitimacy even though they've changed the rules? Moved the goal posts, taken away the stumps, bulldozed the playing field and made up their own rules.

This also quells dissent, sells parrot papers and invites the rest of to think we're being attacked by witches and demons. Being a doctor, architect or even minding your own business is less important to the government than the illusion of a 'war on terror' whereby the feds are feeding the parrot people to give us propaganda 1984.

Think about it! When did the last bomb go off? The Hilton! Who was more likely responsible? ASIO! Trust us we know best!

According to one report, Lodhi has previously told the court he acquired the maps and chemical price list for business ventures he was contemplating. However, Mr Maidment said today Lodhi had been exposed as a liar after claiming he had consulted a list of products used to make detergents on the Deltrex Chemicals website and then phoning the company about prices, saying he was planning to open a detergent business. He said Lodhi could not even name the main washing powder brands or who the main companies in the industry were. "What did Mr Lodhi know about a detergent business?" Mr Maidment asked the jury. "Well not much more than me, apparently". He said the washing powder brand Surf was about the only name "he could come up with".

Perhaps you can also wail about how it was mere circumstance he had met with convicted terrorist Willie Bridgitte

In fact, I have a feeling you'd prefer he was never even arrested and had a chance to blow something up and kill Aussies. Then, you could blame it on John Howard and insist its all something to do with Iraq.

Not even the plot! Wouldn't matter if I made enquiries about how much 1 tone of fertiliser would cost and when is it on special or whether I even used my own name to make the enquire or even if I lied about why I made it?

Thought crime is no crime only in the minds of soothsayers and now the powers that be think they can jail us for life for a thought.

The point is did I buy it? Did I use it?

The second point was they put Willie Brigite in the same situation used with no evidence whatsoever as a scapegoat to promote their illegal and degrading war on terror and war crimes against humanity!

But of course your racist mind could never work that one out!

Where is your material that says Bridgette was a convicted Terrorist? And where was he convicted? And under what circumstances? I don't seem to be able to google the link?

Maybe my google is different to yours?

Results 1 - 100 of about 973 for Willie Bridgette convicted terrorist. (0.64 seconds)
Australian Government Attorneys General's Department - 19 May 2006 ...
Lloyds List DCN Port & Maritime Security and Counter Terrorism Summit ... 2003 - Willie Brigette & others planning to carry out terrorist attacks in ...
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[PDF] Contemplating Justice
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has grown following information from the French judge in. charge of the case of alleged al-Qaeda operative Willie. Brigette, who was detained in Sydney and ...
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